About me

I play a paladin. These are my ramblings about what's going on with my character Denethal in the game.

Monday, July 19, 2010

Behavior in groups towards tanks.

I like to tank. Not because it makes me feel in control or in charge, but because it's always a challenge to keep the mobs on you with all the stupid actions done by those I end up in a party with.

You could say that I do it to hone my skills, but what skill would that be? Improving the "thick skin" skill? Mental defenses against stupidity and spinebreaking insults?

Tanking a heroic doesn't take much skill, nor gear. All that's required is that you meet the defense cap, which is 535, to avoid getting hit by crits hard enough to send you back to your mothers womb. That's it.
The amount of health isn't all that important, 22-25000 healthpoints is more than suitable, it just means that you'll have to do smarter pulls and not grab half the instance in one go.

But meeting these basic criteria seems to be not enough for most damagedealers today. Even some of the healers cringe of having to heal a low HP tank. They simply can not fathom being in a group with a tank with less than 30,000 HP. Their minds are stubbornly set on the mentality that your healthpoints equals your skill as tank.

And they will whine and they will cry. They will try to kick you or make you leave by any means necessary. Being a tank is a thankless task. While I can run around with nothing, except my axe, in heroics as a damagedealer, imagine the outcry if I gathered only blue gear to tank with. I'd get chewed out.
I've seen people who've just dinged 80 and are great tanks, with a mixture of green, blues and purples on them. But that is not good enough for the retards.

Comments regarding the health is always what pops up first. Comments such as "lol l2tank, 24k hp?!?" can come from a rogue doing 1400-1600 DPS. Which is barely enough to carry their own weight through the instance. And from better geared damagedealers, it's even worse. They seem to expect that every tank that's in the LFG tool should be as good as their guilds maintank and dishes out the max damage they can, with no consideration to threat levels or difference in gearlevels.
And you as the tank is the one to blame if they should happen to get killed by the mob they repeatedly pull off you.

I've had my runs as a tank. I'm also one who won't take non-constructive or the blame for others mistakes.

One run I remember in particularly was when I first started tanking in heroics. My gear was not of the best, but I was defense capped and had focused more on avoidance than on the health pool. So I was both crit-immune and avoidance capped, meaning I would take damage in spikes, but then again, not huge spikes.

A mage in the group, clearly a raider, kept whining about my low health and every time she nuked a mob and gained aggro, she would yell "l2tank, noob!". Being somewhat new to tanking, I just shrugged it off and kept on pulling groups at the speed that seemed to work best with both me and the healer in the group, allowing some downtime to let him regain mana. This was too slow for the mage, so she kept pulling. And pulling. And pulling. She was a nightmare.

After she died once, she started to complain even more and wanted to replace me as tank, because I was clearly unable to tank properly. I should keep aggro at all times, no matter what. It was clearly a l2tank problem, so I should be replaced.

So I snapped. "Yes, it may be my responsibility to build aggro as best as I can, but it is -your- responsibility to stay beneath me threatwise and still do as much damage as you can. If you can't comprehend such a basic concept, then I'm surprised you're allowed to raid with your guild."
I also whispered the healer to just stop healing her, she was not worth the effort.

She left after she died a few more times. And me and the rest of the party finished the instance with no problems.

To return to the behavior of people in a random group, why do the ones who's not really needed any more, (Yes, you "DPS" people,) insist on whining whenever something is not exactly up to their standard? Why are you allowed to do sub-par damage and in pvp-gear allowed to behave like pricks?

The only one who got any right to complain about aggro is the healer. And if I'm waiting for the healer to finish the manabreak, then you're waiting too. Go ahead and pull, I dare you. ;)

13 comments:

  1. I entirely agree. "GOGOGO"-DPS are the worst kind and yet they still keep wondering why there are so few tanks out there. I've stopped tanking (i.e. boosting) those morons ages ago.

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  2. The gogogog players also have some love for healers in the form of "helz lol" or "nub where was my healz" after they pulled something with a big axe.

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  3. I kinda agree with you on what you say, as my first char was a Warrior tank, i think its our responsability/duty to set the rithym of the run, and to do so we should be able to analise the diferent skills of diferent partys and making it the smothest run possible.

    But there is a counter point that sometimes we as tanks miss and as im leveling my resto/feral(cat) druid on "The Pug" (Lahbonar /waves Denethal) am able to live through this are the other tanks that aren't like this the rushing tanks, the i dont care about anyone else tanks so some dps's/healer's try to abduct that leader's duty from the tank, some's do it the good way others are just plain stupid.

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  4. Tanking causes health problem, known fact. To be serious, we all know the DPS that pulls before the tank can go rot in hell(Or floor). But I don't really blame them when they pull off me in a pack. I don't mark in a dungeon, that's just a waste of my time, and I know that /assist isn't known by a lot of people. Sometimes I don't even care if the DPS went to solo the caster mobs, since most DPS can do that themselves.

    We all hate the DGing dumb DKs in a five man don't we? But there're also times when a DK pulls the caster mobs right next to me, making my life easier. I guess it all depends ono the situation.

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  5. I only play (tank) with my wife(healer) and son(dps) Since I am protected from the vote to kick, the first time I get the gogogog, or L2tank etc, I sit my ass down and have a nice conversation about how if they want to go faster they should leave group.

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  6. As a healer if there is one of the "lol l2p" retards in the group they don't get heals or resses. They usually die and leave group faster than I can vote to kick.

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  7. I felt your post worthy of a full response.

    http://csahf.blogspot.com/2010/07/its-not-just-tanks-that-are-idiots-it.html

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  8. You claim "I like to tank. Not because it makes me feel in control or in charge", and in same paragraph say "stupid actions done by those I end up in a party with".

    Clearly some dps are jerks, and will get under you skin. The raider mage was in that run because of a design Blizz made that made top-end gear (which raiders need to raid) drop from heroics (emblems). The mage should have waited longer, and was clearly a jerk to you, but probably didn't want to be in the heroic - just wanted the emblems.

    Unless you're simply venting about that specific run, you are actually tanking to feel superior to others.
    And guess what, it's not as easy to be top 8'th on dps charts in a hard-core raiding guild, as it is to tank a heroic (speaking from experience).

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  9. @last Anonymous: It appears that I stroke a nerve here, since you feel the need to claim that I'm doing it to feel superior and by mentioning your location on damage charts in hardmode raids..

    However, you've missed the entire point of the post. Feel free to reread it. :)

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  10. tbh, I've tanked badly gearead level 80 DK (4k gearscore in tank gear ~30k health) with partially blue gear.

    I never had any complaints, mainly because I pull like mad. When I tank I chain pull to the limit of my capacity and my runs are usually very fast.

    gogogo dps? naa... I'm the gogogo tank! If you have fail dps telling you to gogo you should maybe consider pulling faster than an old granny who needs to do a ready check before each pull...

    just sayin...

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  11. @Okrane S.: With ~30k health, you're actually geared for things like Naxxramas 25 and Ulduar.

    I've also stated that there's good and bad tanks. I've been a damagedealer with newly dinged tanks that's done a better job than tanks with over 5k gearscore.

    My post is in defense of those who have just started out as tanks. Give them a chance. That's all. :)

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  12. I know it's a bit late to comment on this one, but I really want to share this: I was doing random hc on my waaay overgeared dk. Violet Hold. Behold a dwarf warrior tank with blues and quest greens. I take a glance at his gear stats, enchants, talent choices and I could say right on the spot this guy will rock this place. The party started a bit of drama over his gear, nothing to serious. But the little guy's confidence was nowhere near to be shaken, we went on with the pulls. The instance was finished fast, with no wipes very little aggro stealing (which were quickly fixed by the the tank). The warrior didn't say a thing the whole time until the end. When all was over he started jumping around saying something like "What do you think now ? Am i a good tank" and the shammy healer goes "Yeah, you are...". Loved that dwarf warrior.

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  13. @Okrane: Agreed! Maybe you just need to step it up and improve your threat generation and AoE aggro. If a DPS aggroes, it just means you need to save your taunt, mocking blow, intervene, charge, intercept, concussion blow for those instances. I hate healing lazy tanks who just let the DPS steal aggro. Don't forget to give Vigilance to the DPS who has the highest threat!

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